Do you feel re-instituting the draft is the unconstitutional?

Giving people a choice as to whether or not they want to serve in the military as infringing on their rights?

If we did re-institute the draft to help combat battle fatigue and rising PTSD rates, then would the entire military system have to be overhauled? Would military families loose benefits because in essence, every able-bodied man would be serving, including those married and with children?

It's not unconstitutional, but there's NO WAY the current economy/military budget could handle even a partial draft..

I had a letter published in an open forum, here's a copy paste of what I think from the archive of the local paper... This is JMO, and what I think about drafts.. If someone can show me where I'm wrong and re-educate me, I'd definitely reconsider my POV..:yes

Rep. Rangel introduced the military draft legislation to make a political point against the war, not because he thinks his bills have any chance of passing. He's full of it when he introduced the legislation.

According to the Selective Service, there are 11 million men registered ages 18 to 26. However, the bills that (goofy) man wrote applied to females as well, so let's double it to 22 million.

Assume that 22 million "draftees" are serving in the grade of E-1 (the very lowest enlisted grade). An E-1 in today's military starts off at $1278.50 per month.

That comes to a payroll of $28 billion dollars per month, just in the basic pay. It's a yearly payroll of $337 billion dollars.

We also have to feed these troops. Currently, it's $200 per month to feed a Joe. So, we'll have to add $52.8 billion dollars to our military budget.

Where are these 22 million troops going to live? Well, we certainly can't house them in the Louisiana Superdome. Military personnel receive a housing allowance that, for an E-1 averages about $800 per month. That's a housing budget of $211 billion dollars per year..

Add the costs for uniforms, equipment, training, dental, relocation expenses, etc.

We can barely afford our current force-levels of 1.5 million active duty members. Our country doesn't need a draft, nor could we afford bringing even a small percentage of our population on active duty.

Rep. Rangel is playing games with the media. But even worse then that? Politicians are playing on the fears of their constituents as parents. I hope you don't buy into these scare tactics, there's nothing to worry about.

I never considered the PTSD counseling that many vets would need, perhaps that would also have to be added in.... I don't think an overhaul per-se would quite do it..

I had a letter published in an open forum, here's a copy paste of what I think from the archive of the local paper... This is JMO, and what I think about drafts.. If someone can show me where I'm wrong and re-educate me, I'd definitely reconsider my POV..:yes



I never considered the PTSD counseling that many vets would need, perhaps that would also have to be added in.... I don't think an overhaul per-se would quite do it..

are you saying it would be near impossible?

If you think about what a draft could do. I mean it would completely change the American landscape......almost like a smaller WW2 era.

Although weren't a lot of military bases just used for training purposes in WW2? I know they are still using WW2 barracks and even WW1 barracks were still in use in Vietnam at FLW. (totally off on a tangent :giggle)

Anyway....

I don't think there would be as much support for military families. I think because the military has been something of choice for the past 40 years, that it has changed significantly. People talk about coming back with the draft, and if it ever did pass in the Senate, it would almost certainly be challanged if the president happened to sign off on it.

It would just be an astounding, propersterous thing to even consider doing, and it would take so much to accommidate that amount of people coming into service.

It's not unconstitutional, but there's NO WAY the current economy/military budget could handle even a partial draft..

I agree. Here's where I break with most everyone else. I think it should be mandatory that everyone, upon high school graduation/18th b-day, that they serve a two year stint in the branch of their choice. Flame away, I'm solid in my opinion on this:grin:

I agree. Here's where I break with most everyone else. I think it should be mandatory that everyone, upon high school graduation/18th b-day, that they serve a two year stint in the branch of their choice. Flame away, I'm solid in my opinion on this:grin:

Teach those boys how to make their beds and scrub a floor!!!! :rofl

Teach those boys how to make their beds and scrub a floor!!!! :rofl


DH still can't make our bed worth a crap, so I guess the army failed us.....Or he's just a lazy bum at home:D

I forgot we still had a constitution, at least anything other then the 2nd Amend.
Leftover, presuming all pay and benefits in the military stay the same, there are important financial considerations that you are forgetting.
But drafting everyone between the ages of 18 and 24, it will reduce the younger entry level work force. Older Americans will stay in their jobs longer, saving us some social security, unemployment, and welfare benefits.
No one between the ages of 18 and 24 will be collecting unemployment, social security, or other government benefits.
Rather then sending billions a month to Afghanistan, we will have enough troops to send of our own.
Since the draft will most likely include non-military positions, we will finally have enough healthcare workers, firefighters, etc.
Instead of keeping our troops in combat for 12-to 18 months, we will have enough to rotate every 6 months or so. It will mean more deployments, but shorter ones, saving many marriages, and preventing many ptsd issues.
Universal healthcare, especially for children, will finally be possible, because of the VA benefits.
Our prisons may be less crowded (hopefully) because instead of the crimes created by boredom, mostly drug related, the people will have been in military service before they had that opportunity (hopefully).
If every drafted VA was guaranteed at least a minimum college/trade school education, that would help the economy in the long term.
Id we had an armed force consisting of many more soldiers, maybe some other countries would bluster less, because we would finally have enough troops to back up our threats.
If kids knew that they could be sent to war, they may actually give more of a damn and get more involved in our government and voting, etc.

There would hopefully be less blind trust in our government.

Also, as someone mentioned above, I am sure the entire pay/bah/benefits system would be restructured.

I agree. Here's where I break with most everyone else. I think it should be mandatory that everyone, upon high school graduation/18th b-day, that they serve a two year stint in the branch of their choice. Flame away, I'm solid in my opinion on this:grin:

Basically like Israel right?

I forgot we still had a constitution, at least anything other then the 2nd Amend.
Leftover, presuming all pay and benefits in the military stay the same, there are important financial considerations that you are forgetting.
But drafting everyone between the ages of 18 and 24, it will reduce the younger entry level work force. Older Americans will stay in their jobs longer, saving us some social security, unemployment, and welfare benefits.
No one between the ages of 18 and 24 will be collecting unemployment, social security, or other government benefits.
Rather then sending billions a month to Afghanistan, we will have enough troops to send of our own.
Since the draft will most likely include non-military positions, we will finally have enough healthcare workers, firefighters, etc.
Instead of keeping our troops in combat for 12-to 18 months, we will have enough to rotate every 6 months or so. It will mean more deployments, but shorter ones, saving many marriages, and preventing many ptsd issues.
Universal healthcare, especially for children, will finally be possible, because of the VA benefits.
Our prisons may be less crowded (hopefully) because instead of the crimes created by boredom, mostly drug related, the people will have been in military service before they had that opportunity (hopefully).
If every drafted VA was guaranteed at least a minimum college/trade school education, that would help the economy in the long term.
Id we had an armed force consisting of many more soldiers, maybe some other countries would bluster less, because we would finally have enough troops to back up our threats.
If kids knew that they could be sent to war, they may actually give more of a damn and get more involved in our government and voting, etc.

There would hopefully be less blind trust in our government.

Also, as someone mentioned above, I am sure the entire pay/bah/benefits system would be restructured.


Oh So true. I am in complete middle ground with you all. I just wanted to educate myself on the issue.

I agree. Here's where I break with most everyone else. I think it should be mandatory that everyone, upon high school graduation/18th b-day, that they serve a two year stint in the branch of their choice. Flame away, I'm solid in my opinion on this:grin:

Right.

Are you aware that fewer than 50% of all high school graduates in this country are physically eligible for military service? Then from that 50%, you have to take out the ones who simply can not make an adequate score on the ASVAB.

From what's left, you'd have to eliminate all the women, unless you plan to write a law requiring females to be drafted. Assuming you could/would get that done, you'd have to eliminate all pregnant females (not physically eligible). You'd also have to eliminate all illegal aliens (not eligible for draft).

What do you propose we do with the ones who don't qualify physically, mentally, or academically?

Right.

Are you aware that fewer than 50% of all high school graduates in this country are physically eligible for military service? Then from that 50%, you have to take out the ones who simply can not make an adequate score on the ASVAB.

From what's left, you'd have to eliminate all the women, unless you plan to write a law requiring females to be drafted. Assuming you could/would get that done, you'd have to eliminate all pregnant females (not physically eligible). You'd also have to eliminate all illegal aliens (not eligible for draft).

What do you propose we do with the ones who don't qualify physically, mentally, or academically?

the illegal aliens part struck my interest.......I'm not for illegal immigration (I think you should come here legally), but I think if a person who wanted to immigrate here served in a US Military Branch, then that should give them some rights as a US citizen, or make them a US Citizen. That would give some relief on the problem of illegal immigrants. Just an idea (dont flame me for it!!!)

Also, the whole mandatory 2 year thing for everyone who's 18/high school graduate, there's the 'able to die for our country but not old enough to drink' argument.

AND if the draft was implemented, there would be little if ANY support for military families (since almost EVERY family would be a military family).


Quote:
Originally Posted by guynavywife
I forgot we still had a constitution, at least anything other then the 2nd Amend.
Leftover, presuming all pay and benefits in the military stay the same, there are important financial considerations that you are forgetting.
But drafting everyone between the ages of 18 and 24, it will reduce the younger entry level work force. Older Americans will stay in their jobs longer, saving us some social security, unemployment, and welfare benefits.
No one between the ages of 18 and 24 will be collecting unemployment, social security, or other government benefits.
Rather then sending billions a month to Afghanistan, we will have enough troops to send of our own.
Since the draft will most likely include non-military positions, we will finally have enough healthcare workers, firefighters, etc.
Instead of keeping our troops in combat for 12-to 18 months, we will have enough to rotate every 6 months or so. It will mean more deployments, but shorter ones, saving many marriages, and preventing many ptsd issues.
Universal healthcare, especially for children, will finally be possible, because of the VA benefits.
Our prisons may be less crowded (hopefully) because instead of the crimes created by boredom, mostly drug related, the people will have been in military service before they had that opportunity (hopefully).
If every drafted VA was guaranteed at least a minimum college/trade school education, that would help the economy in the long term.
Id we had an armed force consisting of many more soldiers, maybe some other countries would bluster less, because we would finally have enough troops to back up our threats.
If kids knew that they could be sent to war, they may actually give more of a damn and get more involved in our government and voting, etc.

There would hopefully be less blind trust in our government.

Also, as someone mentioned above, I am sure the entire pay/bah/benefits system would be restructured.



I'm on middle ground.

I agree. Here's where I break with most everyone else. I think it should be mandatory that everyone, upon high school graduation/18th b-day, that they serve a two year stint in the branch of their choice. Flame away, I'm solid in my opinion on this:grin:

i sort of agree with this.. i think it should be a choice of either military or civil service like americorp or something.. i think sweden does this too but its one year

I forgot we still had a constitution, at least anything other then the 2nd Amend.
Leftover, presuming all pay and benefits in the military stay the same, there are important financial considerations that you are forgetting.
But drafting everyone between the ages of 18 and 24, it will reduce the younger entry level work force. Older Americans will stay in their jobs longer, saving us some social security, unemployment, and welfare benefits.
No one between the ages of 18 and 24 will be collecting unemployment, social security, or other government benefits.
Rather then sending billions a month to Afghanistan, we will have enough troops to send of our own.
Since the draft will most likely include non-military positions, we will finally have enough healthcare workers, firefighters, etc.
Instead of keeping our troops in combat for 12-to 18 months, we will have enough to rotate every 6 months or so. It will mean more deployments, but shorter ones, saving many marriages, and preventing many ptsd issues.
Universal healthcare, especially for children, will finally be possible, because of the VA benefits.
Our prisons may be less crowded (hopefully) because instead of the crimes created by boredom, mostly drug related, the people will have been in military service before they had that opportunity (hopefully).
If every drafted VA was guaranteed at least a minimum college/trade school education, that would help the economy in the long term.
Id we had an armed force consisting of many more soldiers, maybe some other countries would bluster less, because we would finally have enough troops to back up our threats.
If kids knew that they could be sent to war, they may actually give more of a damn and get more involved in our government and voting, etc.

There would hopefully be less blind trust in our government.

Also, as someone mentioned above, I am sure the entire pay/bah/benefits system would be restructured.


Well, drafting "everyone" would be mandatory service, not really a draft. The draft is for need. So the people they need, they randomly pick. Kids may be more involved or they may riot more, burn their draft cards and move to Canada. Older Americans of the baby boom age can only stay in their jobs for so long, they eventually will be too old to work or will die. Then what? There already is concern in many jobs (DoD civilian and air traffic controllers, for example) where the age gap is so great the knowledge will be lost.

That aside, the money and resources it would take to pay, train and maintain forces for ALL is way over what anyone would pay. The war is expensive and adding MORE troops to the armed forces would not offset the cost of the war, it would just add to the DOD budget. None of these other things would offset enough to allow this to happen.

Mandatory service, while I think it's an interesting idea, may not work for such a large country. I'm not sure what the benefit of 2 year service for 22 million people would be. Israel is a relatively small country and it can work for them.

Right.

Are you aware that fewer than 50% of all high school graduates in this country are physically eligible for military service? Then from that 50%, you have to take out the ones who simply can not make an adequate score on the ASVAB.

From what's left, you'd have to eliminate all the women, unless you plan to write a law requiring females to be drafted. Assuming you could/would get that done, you'd have to eliminate all pregnant females (not physically eligible). You'd also have to eliminate all illegal aliens (not eligible for draft).

What do you propose we do with the ones who don't qualify physically, mentally, or academically?

It works for Israel, and I believe they have a choice as to civil service OR military service, yes, women are included in that. If illegal immigrants want to come here I am all for giving them citizenship in exchange for military service. Everything has exclusions, but the point is IMO I believe something along this line might just work. Just because I have not worn the uniform doesn't mean I cannot have an opinion on military things.