View Full Version : Well now...


Aundi
02-16-2006, 10:08 PM
Isen't that special! My dh narrowly escaped going to Kuwait for 18 months! He would have had to leave on March 5th! A guy volunteered instead. No one is safe anymore! I would have dealt believe you me, but this is just scary........it's like they are basically doing away with shore duty. When you can't be content and know that you are not going anywhere that's NOT shore duty:sick

Sailors on the ground
Deployments could send 2,000 more to war zones

By Mark D. Faram
Times staff writer


Thousands of sailors are gearing up for war, but they won’t ride into battle on gray ships.
At least they won’t in this war.

Over the next six months, the Navy expects to order as many as 2,000 more sailors to war zones inside the Central Command area of operations.

The bulk of those sailors will head to Iraq or Afghanistan for six-month to one-year tours in an ever-increasing effort to help spell war-weary Army and Marine Corps units.

The new deployments, confirmed by Navy officials Feb. 7, would increase the number of sailors serving in CentCom ground-based operations to roughly 12,000.

“Over the coming months and into the summer, the Navy presence on the ground in Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere in theater will continue to grow and could reach as high as 10,000 to 12,000 sailors,” Cmdr. John Kirby, spokesman for Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Mike Mullen, said Feb. 7.

What this means for every sailor in the Navy, the Navy’s top personnel admiral says, is clear: Be ready to deploy. Now.

This new mandate not only applies to sailors on sea duty — where deployments are expected — but also to those on shore duty who could get sent forward to help with the fight in Iraq or Afghanistan.

“There are no sidelines anymore,” Vice Adm. John Harvey, the Navy’s chief of personnel, told Navy Times in a Feb. 3 interview. “If you’re wearing this uniform, you are on the front line of service.”

That mandate not only includes active sailors, but also selective and individual ready reservists, any of whom could get a call or even volunteer to go.

This news comes as Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Mike Mullen announced that the numbers of sailors on the ground in Afghanistan and Iraq will increase from today’s 4,000 to nearly 6,000 in a few months.

Stretch the picture to a theater-wide look and that number could increase to a total of 12,000 sailors serving in or near the war zones, including in Kuwait and Bahrain, as well as those involved in operations in the Horn of Africa.

Those numbers don’t include sailors serving on ships moving in and out of the Central Command area of operations.

It also doesn’t include thousands of sailors who have been plucked from their own service to support the war from joint jobs in Northern and Southern commands, as well as in Europe.

This ramp-up started last summer, when the Navy announced the creation of the riverine warfare units and expeditionary battalions that are part of the Navy’s largest expeditionary posture since at least the Vietnam War, and possibly since World War II.

Be ready

To date, the Navy’s presence on the ground in the war zones has been with traditional, pre-existing units that rotate in and out of the war zones as part of regular deployments.

These units, both active and reserve, have largely been groups of Seabees, SEALs, and coastal warfare and combat helicopter squadrons.

Also rotating in are medical personnel who normally are assigned to naval hospitals and whose billets require them to deploy as part of Marine Expeditionary Forces to man forward aid stations. In addition, medical personnel and chaplains and their support teams deploy with Marine units.

And officials say those deployments will continue. What is changing is that an increasing number of sailors not in deploying units are being tabbed as individual augmentees. These sailors are being pulled from commands throughout the service, many from shore-duty jobs. Officials say no one is immune from getting the call.

What is not clear is how many sailors are volunteering and how many are being told to deploy.

“We’d like to go with volunteers, and we have a way for [reservists] to indicate they want to volunteer,” said Capt. Kathy Isgrig, who heads the Navy’s efforts to fill these IA wartime jobs from her Pentagon office in Arlington, Va.

Harvey, the Navy’s chief of personnel, said he plans to implement a reservelike system in the active component, where sailors can have their electronic record tagged if they want to volunteer.

But if volunteers can’t be found for a position, some sailors will be sent involuntarily.

“The other thought out there is, anyone in a uniform is a volunteer,” Isgrig said.

That’s why, Harvey said, being able to deploy on a moment’s notice could become a deciding factor in whether a sailor is allowed to re-enlist.

“Commanders need to know who is ready to go and who isn’t,” Harvey said. He plans to implement new procedures Navywide to determine who is deployment-ready and who is not.

Harvey said he realizes personal, family and medical issues can temporarily make it difficult or impossible to deploy a sailor, but when those issues consistently prevent a sailor from deploying, career problems could result.

Readiness for deployment “is going to become a condition of service. If we can’t maintain you in a condition of readiness ... can you serve?”

Skills needed

The categories of sailors the Navy is sending continue to grow.

“There’s an awful lot of skills these great sailors have that are directly applicable,” Harvey said.

To date, those most likely to be sent to a war zone are sailors with medical, intelligence security and construction skills, Harvey said. Though in smaller numbers, officials said, administrative and supply types also are filling billets. “The requests I’ve seen have pretty much run the gamut of what the Navy is able to provide,” Harvey said.

And the calls for help are not stopping, either.

Tops among roles that could increase is explosive ordnance disposal, which Harvey said is on the threshold of major participation in the counter-improvised explosive device task force being formed.

“The greatest threat to our troops over there right now is the IED, and the Navy has the best people in the world to deal with that [threat],” Harvey said, alluding to the fact that sailors train the other services in ordnance disposal at the Navy’s school at Eglin Air Force Base, Fla.

“I’ve told the system to gear up and get ready, because we’re going to support this.”

But it’s not just the EOD sailors who are going to get into the IED fight.

“I suspect we’re going have a greater demand for our electronic warfare capability ... to help in this counter-IED fight,” Harvey said.

Who’s going

A majority of those called individually are being used as plug-ins for joint staff or task forces, and Isgrig’s office is responsible for finding bodies as these requirements trickle in.

She’s also responsible for finding a replacement for sailors at the end of their tours, too — meaning thousands more sailors will get called for duty in the future.

“Once we fill a requirement, we assume there will be the need to continue filling that requirement until we are told it no longer exists,” Isgrig said.

But in the past year, a growing part of her job has also been using these IAs in provisional units created from scratch.

“If we’ve got an existing unit, the preference is to send an organized and existing unit, active or reserve, [versus] creating capability as we go along,” Isgrig said.

But that dynamic is changing, and fast. Already, units of IAs have been formed, trained and deployed.

One such unit has just taken over guarding prisoners at Fort Suse, a prison in northern Iraq. Another example is the companies of sailors expected to take over guarding detainees at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, at the end of the month.

“As we create those capabilities, they don’t tend to be active or reserve; instead, they are total force mixes,” Isgrig said.

She also said that in some cases, provisional units with members from more than one service are being created.

On the table are six more of these provisional units, called reconstruction teams, that will be sent to Afghanistan to help rebuild infrastructure in the region — work U.S. officials see as key for long-term survival of the fledgling democracy there.

Though each will be commanded by an active-duty post-command Navy commander, they will be joint units, Isgrig said. The units must contain some offensive combat capability such as infantry — not a sailor’s normal area of expertise. Those traditional combat arms duties will continue to be handled by soldiers and Marines.

Sailors will stick to exercising skills they’re best suited for.

“Where the Navy can help is filling in with combat support and combat service support roles,” Isgrig said.

Like many defense officials, Harvey sees the war on terrorism as “a long war” in which the Navy’s role is only going to increase.

That means these requirements aren’t going away anytime soon, and more and more sailors will be getting the call to become “dirt sailors,” as some are fond of calling themselves.

That’s why Harvey believes the service will have to use more reservists in this effort, requiring not only changes in the Navy’s practices, but also changes to laws.

“I’ve got the time to accomplish this change on my watch,” Harvey said. “Clearly, it is something that we must do for the service in the long run.”

Sarah
02-16-2006, 10:09 PM
Yup, it's what I have saying all along. Shore duty doesn't mean squat anymore. Look at my husband and Heidi's husband :no :sigh

Aundi
02-16-2006, 10:23 PM
I feel for you girls! I mean I will deal if it comes down to it because I have no choice but if my DH had known that things would come to this he would not have stayed in. This life is already unstable enough.

Caimbrie
02-16-2006, 10:30 PM
I'm just really happy that my husband is useless over there.

Aundi
02-16-2006, 10:34 PM
No one is useless over there anymore. They were going to send my dh to a two month school in Texas. He is an AW.........FAR removed from anything remotely to do with over there:(

Caimbrie
02-16-2006, 10:39 PM
My husband is a nuke electrician on a sub... I'm pretty sure there's nothing they could do to send him there.. at least he tells me that lol

VinnysGirl
02-16-2006, 10:39 PM
That's just really unnerving

Mao
02-16-2006, 10:45 PM
dont be so sure - my df started as a nuke electrician and he ended up out there!!

Michele
02-17-2006, 06:26 PM
My husband is a nuke electrician on a sub... I'm pretty sure there's nothing they could do to send him there.. at least he tells me that lol

I'm confident my dh will never be sent there either. He's got too many years of submarine schooling under his belt. He would more likely be sent to a deploying sub off of shore duty then ever being sent over there.

Breezy
02-17-2006, 06:40 PM
THey can and will send Nukes to 9545 if need be to fill the billets!!
This was posted in the news a few days ago too

mamaoftwins+1
02-17-2006, 06:43 PM
This was posted in the news a few days ago too
about nukes being sent over there or sailors in general?

mamaoftwins+1
02-17-2006, 06:54 PM
My husband is a nuke electrician on a sub... I'm pretty sure there's nothing they could do to send him there.. at least he tells me that lol
this is what i have been told also

Breezy
02-17-2006, 07:02 PM
about nukes being sent over there or sailors in general?
the sailors it was in the news and debate forum :D
IF they were to send Nukes it wouldn't take away from their jobs they would go TAD and then still have their nuke quales for when their time is up with the TAD

Brialee
02-17-2006, 07:02 PM
Let's not start this again, pretty please? We all know there are rates that are more likely to go, we know that there may come a day when EVERYBODY will have to go, for now, there are some sailors out there but it's not uncommon to have sailors in land operations. It's happened in every war we've ever fought.

I asked my husband what his probabilities were (he's also a nuke EM on a sub) and he told me that there's a very slim chance almost none that he may have to go. He said the Navy pays out a lot of money to train them to do what they are doing so they're not about to let all that go to waste. We are also short on nuke's as it is so he says, there's not much of a chance, BUT it could still happen, NOBODY knows for sure. He said the only way he's going to Iraq is if he volunteers to do so. Regardless of whether he does or not, I'm going to have to deal with it, I'm just not going to dwell on it starting now.

Brialee
02-17-2006, 07:05 PM
There are also benefits to going to Iraq. I think just the thought of what happens over there is what freaks everybody out, with good reason but they do make up for it. I know it sucks that he'd be gone for a year to a year and a half but believe me that comes at a price.

HEIDI
02-17-2006, 07:07 PM
My dh is 97% for sure going March 5th... I am parying for Uncel Sam to change his mind again

mamaoftwins+1
02-17-2006, 07:12 PM
the sailors it was in the news and debate forum :D
IF they were to send Nukes it wouldn't take away from their jobs they would go TAD and then still have their nuke quales for when their time is up with the TAD
i cant find it can you help me?

Brialee
02-17-2006, 07:14 PM
I know and I feel for you girls who's husbands are already on their way up there. God bless them and you guys that are having to deal with this right now. I know we argue about who's going and who isn't but it's already starting to affect some of us on here so I think we ALL realize that we may be going through the same thing at some point.

Breezy
02-17-2006, 07:28 PM
http://forum.militarysos.com/showthread.php?t=5819
here is is Amanda

I wasn't trying to start anything but there is NO DEFINATE period that has been stated too many times. Some will never believe until it happens to them

Dh has said that will never happen over several things since 9/11 to find out that they really can and did mainly to him etc..
I had bet him 100bucks that he will be in Cuba or Iraq before we leave here. He said I was crazy until he checked in and they told him to be prepared
So Crazy things happen all the time
They can only stretch certain rates so thin
As for Nukes yeah they do spend too much money to send them over but they also spend too much to let them out at 4 & 6 years too.
JMO though

Jennifer
02-17-2006, 07:39 PM
Wow that was a good article. They talk about security clearance. Makes me scared my dh just got the highest clearance they have in the Navy. He is an IT and very deployable.

Brialee
02-17-2006, 07:42 PM
Oh, I didn't mean that they spend too much money sending nukes over there. I meant they spend too much money training them for what they do now, not on sending them over there. I also meant that sending anybody to Iraq is costly because isn't all that tax free? I do get what you're saying though Breezy. Like I said, nobody's exempt from going over there, just nobody knows for sure who is going and when, that's all.

Breezy
02-17-2006, 07:48 PM
I agree they spend way too much on school and bonus period for nukes that is why I agree 100% with you ;)

Breezy
02-17-2006, 07:50 PM
Ok let me rephrase I know someone has to do it so yeah they have to spend the money but I think it should be more than just a regular enlistment
Just like some of these other programs. All of the training that my dh got in VA for the MSS stuff that is a butt ton of money to spend and then let the said person out at 2 and 4 years
again this is JMO

Brialee
02-17-2006, 08:02 PM
Don't get me wrong, I think they deserve every penny they get be it in form of pay or bonuses because they do work hard for it. Of course, I'm going to stick up for my hubby here. There's a reason why they get the bonuses and pay that they get. I don't think that they are wasting their money on their training. I think they are spending alot of money on training them and getting them prepared for what they have to do to turn around and have them do something that has totally nothing to do with their training. Nukes aren't the only ones that get big bonuses.

Michele
02-17-2006, 08:11 PM
My dh is not a nuke. However his qualifications and training on a submarine make him invalueable on a sub. I can see them pulling someone off a surface ship before pulling a submariner off. Submarine duty is volunteer...not many want to do it in the first place.

Breezy
02-17-2006, 08:19 PM
well I am going to stop before i piss someone off ;)

Caimbrie
02-17-2006, 08:19 PM
Don't get me wrong, I think they deserve every penny they get be it in form of pay or bonuses because they do work hard for it. Of course, I'm going to stick up for my hubby here. There's a reason why they get the bonuses and pay that they get. I don't think that they are wasting their money on their training. I think they are spending alot of money on training them and getting them prepared for what they have to do to turn around and have them do something that has totally nothing to do with their training. Nukes aren't the only ones that get big bonuses.

I agree

Brialee
02-17-2006, 08:35 PM
Like Michele said, submariners are already volunteers because not everybody is willing to put up with that lifestyle. So Derrick is already doing something not everybody wants to do.

I am not trying to turn this into one of those well, my husband is better than yours type of debate because EVERY job EVERY rate has it's ups and downs BUT there's a reason why certain jobs get paid more than others. My husband just happens to be doing one of those and I've seen what it does to him. Just like someone who works around bombs gets hazardous pay, and deserves the extra money because, hey, it's hazardous working around bombs all day! It's not wrong to reward people for having extra qualifications or training.

Nickschic
02-17-2006, 09:19 PM
Dh just told me lastnight that he is a strong canadaite to be sent.

JMM
02-17-2006, 09:23 PM
Joe and I have been married 4 years and this still seems so new and bizzare to me. Subs seem to be kind of their own special little world. If they yanked Joe off his boat and sent him over there, could they find and immediate replacement (well, yep, I guess they could, how often does sub school graduate?). Oy.

I'll keep my political comments to myself. lol

Breezy
02-17-2006, 09:24 PM
there are plenty of sub guys on shore duty!

Brialee
02-17-2006, 09:38 PM
I know there are plenty of sub guys on shore duty. The difference is for mine anyways, when he goes to shore duty, he has to keep up with his training as a nuke. He's not going to get off shore duty and twiddle his thumbs till someone gives him something to do. He has to go back and relearn anything that may have changed while he was on sea duty, he has to be prepared to operate a sub who's reactor thingiemajigor may have changed while he was on sea duty. His job will always be nuke related no matter if he's on sea or shore duty. Now, could that change certainly, but do you know how far behind he would be if he took a year off to go to Iraq. Not to mention, they are already short on nuke's so I don't think they're going to be quick about shipping them off if they already don't have enough to begin with.

Brialee
02-17-2006, 09:49 PM
burritos and taquitos